The Final Argument

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The Final Argument

• Socrates replies to Cebes by presenting a final
  argument for the immortality of the soul
• Some forms are inseparable from the things that
  have itthey are essential forms. Cold is
  essential to snow, heat is essential to fire,
  oddness is essential to the number 3

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• The soul is that which brings life to the body.
  There can be no soul without life, therefore, the
  life is essential to the soul
• But if life is essential to the soul, then the
  soul cannot die.
• Therefore the soul is immortal

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Criticisms

• Argument assumes that to be alive a body must
  possess a separate thing a soul
• The proper conclusion is not that the soul lives
  forever, but that if there is a soul, there must
  be life
• Just as fire is hot implies that if there is
  fire, there is also heat.

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The main questions of the Republic

• Is it better to be just or unjust?
• What is it for a person to be just?
• What is an ideal city? What makes the ideal city
  a just city.
• Plato connects these moral questions with
  fundamental issues in metaphysics and
  epistemology what is knowledge? What is the true
  nature of reality?

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Book II of the Republic

• Glaucon and Socrates distinguish three different
  kinds of Good?
• Which kind is justice?

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The three kinds of good

• Good in itself (intrinsically good
• Good in itself and for its consequences
• Good only for its consequences (or only good as a
  means)

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• Glaucon argues for the view that justice is a
  good, but only for its consequences, and is in
  fact bad in and of itself
• Socrates holds justice is good in itself and for
  its consequences

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The Ring of Gyges

• Suppose you had a ring that would make you
  invisible (allowing you commit injustice without
  being discovered).
• If such a ring were available how would a just
  persons actions differ from an unjust person?
• (1) If there would be no difference, that shows
  we only think of justice as good as a means.
• (2) If the just person remains just even though
  he can get away with being unjust, then that
  shows that people consider justice to be good.

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• Glaucon Justice is good as a means of avoiding
  suffering injustice. We agree to abide by the
  rules of morality so that other people dont harm
  us, not because its bad to do harm (injustice)
  to other people

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• If the Ring of Gyges example is persuasive, it
  tells us that we think of morality in terms of
  external rewards.
• It does not tell us however that justice really
  is only good for its rewards.
• People could be simply mistaken they might think
  justice is only good for its consequences, while
  really its good for its consequences and for its
  own sake.

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We need to first discover what justice is

• Socrates Justice is easier to discover in a
  city, then in an individual, so lets discover
  what justice is in a city first, then we can
  better see how justice applies to individuals.
• So they begin to discuss what an ideal city would
  be like

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How should the work be divided in the city?

• People should perform only one task.
• Why?

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• People have different natural talents. A well run
  city will have each person do what they are by
  nature best suited for.
• If you work at one task regularly you will get
  better at that task

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• 372a-372c Socrates describes an ideal city.
• But Glaucon objects.

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• The first ideal city lacks luxuries, it is a
  simple city.
• Socrates says while the simple city still strikes
  him as ideal, it might be useful to look into a
  wealthy, feverish, city.

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What new thing do we get with a wealthy, feverish
city?

• WAR!
• We need warriors.
• Following the principle of specialization, these
  warriors need to be those who are best suited for
  the task, a professional army.
• They also need to be trained appropriately.

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Warriors need to be trained

• Music and gymnastic
• Both liberal arts and physical training train the
  soul
• Strict censorship of literary works. Only those
  works that contribute to the virtues of the
  guardians (later called auxilliaries)will be
  allowed.